Levels, leveling, level caps, and level 20 - Page 31 - Guild Wars Forums

Tarun · May 13, 2006, 03:14 PM // 15:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zakarr

Okay...so Anet should raise the level cap because you and some other users in the forum want it? What about me and some other users who don't want to raise the level cap?

ANet has changed a lot of things because people ask and pull for it. It happens all the time. Look at what happened with guild halls getting services. Look at a lot of things in the game. People will always be for and against things, everyone is an individual and have their own opinion. I've never really seen anything unanimous on these forums. People have been against stuff and it still gets added. Things change and things happen. Sometimes for the better, sometimes not. It's a part of trial and error. You've got to try things and take chances to see how things work. ANet does it a lot, so why not try it with the raised level caps. It may not be so bad after all. Have you tried it in Guild Wars with a raised level cap? Well obviously not since it's still level 20. But would it be so bad if they did raise it? You don't know for sure because it hasn't happened. Give it a chance and see how things go.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zakarr

Maybe you should considering other games? Guild Wars has own way to do things. It is that simple.

You have consumed the game in your mind. Time to move on, I guess.

A lot of people are constantly asking for new content. Be it new dungeons/maps/zones, you name it. They want new areas to explore and new content to have something to do. So obviously it's not just level caps.

I bet you've probably signed for new areas yourself. :P

Loviatar · May 13, 2006, 03:31 PM // 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Replicant

I'm a hardcore PvE'er, and as much as i don't want to say it.. the game is getting boring for me once again. My Friends and I left back in october because we found the game incredibly boring after only 1 month time, and the only reason i even log on to GW anymore is for my Guildies if they need help in a specific area.
..

most of you grindmonkeys (wheezer nomenclature) still dont have a clue yet.

this is not an MMORPG grindfest.

this is rpg lite to be a snack you enjoy and when it gets boring you put it away til the next SF or chapter or you get the urge again.

this was never stated to be a full time commitment like EQ/ WOW/ SWG which require the grind you seem to need.

as long as you play that chapter and feel you got your moneys worth and buy the next chapter Anet/NCSoft is happy.

expecting/needing a long term grind game from GW will result in a big let down .

as far as challenge later in the FF series you are joking.

so your level nth to the highest power does 2000 damage per hit on an 8000 hp enemy .

how is that a harder challenge than at the first level where you face an enemy with 8 hp and do 2 hp damage.

from personal experience the hardest core levelgrinders are only playing for the next level so they can point to a level number to prove how superior they are to someone 30 levels lower.

the way these elite players play is simple.

charge enemy get stomped
kill 1000 rats for another level/power boost
charge enemy get stomped again
kill 1100 rats for the next level/power boost.

10 more levels they win by sheer brute force and brag how good a player they are.

rince and repeat to 99 level cap then yell for a level cap raise as the final monsters always beat them and with just a few more levels over the monster they could win

NOTE
additions are not core game changes

Taurus · May 13, 2006, 03:48 PM // 15:48

- Games that requires a lot of time to reach a lvl cap for your character time from time are for FULL TIME GEEKs, outta here you freaks, GW doesnt need you.

- Listen, Im not any way related to Anet or anyone working there, but I am 100% sure they will NEVER ( yeah that means NEVER ) raise the level cap so quit whining and go get your faction points. Remember : NEVER.

- IMO Anet should LOWER the level cap just to make those whining nerds leave our fine game.

MCS · May 13, 2006, 04:01 PM // 16:01

Quote:

Bgnome, Tsunami Rain, Ashleigh McMahon, Red Locust, Mercury Angel, Sarus, unienaule, chris_nin00, Billiard, Dralspire, kamatsu, PieXags, Racthoh, Lasareth, Savio

Where are you?

This thread is in the wrong section, it's filled with flaming, it's been discussed 100 times in the past, it's always come to the same conclusion, AND even if we got 10,000 votes 100% for raising the level cap IT WON'T HAPPEN.

Close this thread, it shouldn't even have made it past the first page...

[FnG] Lazz · May 13, 2006, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCS

Close this thread, it shouldn't even have made it past the first page...

Why should it be closed? Its been open one day and already has had more views and posts than any other topic on the first page so it has obviously got attention. I do somewhat agree about it being in the wrong section though.

MCS · May 13, 2006, 04:10 PM // 16:10

I see you only quoted the part of my post that you read, thats sweet.

I could make a thread flaming everyone on this forum, I guarentee if it was never closed it would pass this thread in 2 hours.

The only reason this topic has attention is because everyone wants to watch the little idiots who don't understand the level cap will never be raised get bashed around.

As for

Quote:

Why should it be closed?

Quote:

This thread is in the wrong section, it's filled with flaming, it's been discussed 100 times in the past, it's always come to the same conclusion, AND even if we got 10,000 votes 100% for raising the level cap IT WON'T HAPPEN.

Hey look, I already told you.

Tarun · May 13, 2006, 04:13 PM // 16:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by [FnG] Lazz

Why should it be closed? Its been open one day and already has had more views and posts than any other topic on the first page so it has obviously got attention. I do somewhat agree about it being in the wrong section though.

The whole reason I posted the poll here, is because this is the same section the previous poll existed.

Zakarr · May 13, 2006, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarun

so why not try it with the raised level caps. It may not be so bad after all. Have you tried it in Guild Wars with a raised level cap? Well obviously not since it's still level 20. But would it be so bad if they did raise it? You don't know for sure because it hasn't happened. Give it a chance and see how things go.

I have played games with 99 level and even with 250 level cap. It is just lazy way to lengthen character advancing. Instead making your character digitally better, you must make yourself better. Why character's power must be tied so heavily to the amount of time you have spent to farm experience when you could spend that time to think good strategies? Also higher level cap would be unfair against people which don't have enough time to sit and play because their character is not fully mature for PvP. However, you can always think better strategies without computer no matter where you are. There is plenty of games with higher level cap. Let Guild Wars be different, will you?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarun

A lot of people are constantly asking for new content. Be it new dungeons/maps/zones, you name it. They want new areas to explore and new content to have something to do. So obviously it's not just level caps.

I bet you've probably signed for new areas yourself. :P

Of course I want new content. This is about raising level cap, right? At least the thread title and the poll gives that impression.

Rakj Grazon · May 13, 2006, 04:24 PM // 16:24

i think lvl 20 should be the max. The idea of this game was to make an mmo that doesnt eat your life. I read in the little add thingy in my box. "The MMO for everyone who hates MMO's, and for those who love them too." if you want 99 lvl then go play D&D, a game more life consuming.

Tarun · May 13, 2006, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zakarr

I have played games with 99 level and even with 250 level cap.

In reference to my question though, you've not tried GW with a higher level cap. You're assuming that it would be a bad thing and it may very well not be. We give things chances in games all the time, so why not this too? Even if the cap is raised 10-20 levels, it couldn't hurt. People only ASSUME that it would be a bad thing with no factual representation from Guild Wars itself to back up what they are saying.

[FnG] Lazz · May 13, 2006, 04:37 PM // 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCS

the little idiots who don't understand the level cap will never be raised get bashed around

Real mature that is. Firstly you go on about how this thread should be closed because of flaming, then you go ahead and call those people who want a higher level cap "little idiots"

The Mighty Toe · May 13, 2006, 04:55 PM // 16:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarun

In reference to my question though, you've not tried GW with a higher level cap. You're assuming that it would be a bad thing and it may very well not be. We give things chances in games all the time, so why not this too? Even if the cap is raised 10-20 levels, it couldn't hurt. People only ASSUME that it would be a bad thing with no factual representation from Guild Wars itself to back up what they are saying.

I'd like to point out though, neither have you. You are also assuming Guild Wars would be better with a higher level cap.

May I just point out to you, as many others have, I believe, that Level 20 does not, I repeat, does not mean that the game is over. For instance:

- Have you done all the Bonuses?
- Have you captured all the Elite skills?
- Have you captured the Halls?
- Have you got your Phoneix?
- Have you made a Guild that has got to #1 on the Ladder?
- Do you have all the Greens?
- Do you have as much money as you can possibly have?

Furthermore, this game is called, a CORPG, a Co-Operative Role Playing Game, hence you are meant to playing in a team, be that team AI controlled or Human controlled, it doesn't matter! Again, may I reiterate a point made by MCS:

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCS

even if we got 10,000 votes 100% for raising the level cap IT WON'T HAPPEN.

[FnG] Lazz · May 13, 2006, 05:04 PM // 17:04

Just to quote a few of your points The Mighty Toe

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Mighty Toe

- Have you done all the Bonuses?

What is the point in doing bonuses if you have reached the highest level? Skillpoints? Skillpoints are fairly useless IMO (I wrote about them earlier)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Mighty Toe

- Have you captured all the Elite skills?
- Do you have all the Greens?
- Do you have as much money as you can possibly have?

For the elite skills and the greens, I dont see the point in capturing 'all' of them if theres only a few which apply to your character. As for the money, no Im not a millionaire but I have got everything I need.

(I know your post wasn't aimed at me but I figured I'd reply to it anyway

)

Loviatar · May 13, 2006, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarun

People only ASSUME that it would be a bad thing with no factual representation from Guild Wars itself to back up what they are saying.

nope

only the idiots who designed the original GW for 5 years carefully balancing and planning it could make the mistake of not fitting in the hardcore grind monks.

in a month most people would hit the cap again and start another round of raise whine.

all it boils down to is a rage at being surrounded by equal level characters when you know you deserve to be above them by grinding.

what you want is basically a seniority system which rewards time played with no regard to ability or skill.

Loviatar · May 13, 2006, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by [FnG] Lazz

What is the point in doing bonuses if you have reached the highest level? Skillpoints? Skillpoints are fairly useless IMO (I wrote about them earlier)

sorry for the double post but this makes my point better than i could have dreamed.

THE BONUS IS CONTENT TO BE PLAYED AND ENJOYED.

TO YOU THE ONLY CONTENT IS LEVEL NOT PLAYING THE GAME.

LEVEL IS EVERYTHING

Zakarr · May 13, 2006, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarun

In reference to my question though, you've not tried GW with a higher level cap. You're assuming that it would be a bad thing and it may very well not be. We give things chances in games all the time, so why not this too? Even if the cap is raised 10-20 levels, it couldn't hurt. People only ASSUME that it would be a bad thing with no factual representation from Guild Wars itself to back up what they are saying.

No offense but if you can't think anything more creative than raising level cap , maybe you should really play something else. It seems that character's level number is some kind of psychologic illusion of true advancing for certain people.

You are also assuming that higher level cap won't hurt. How you know that? Are you one of the GW's developers who experiment new things? We can give our opinions about things but there is no way to proof them because higher level cap is purely subjective thing anyway. Some like it and some don't. Guild Wars is a place for those who don't like higher level cap. Yet, you want to come our beloved place and ruin it for us. That is evil!

Tarun · May 13, 2006, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zakarr

No offense but if you can't think anything more creative than raising level cap, maybe you should really play something else.

Check out the suggestions forum, I've posted a few minor ideas such as being able to say you're using a rare weapon and it showing up in gold text, cancel button for entering guild scrims and a few other things.

Pevil Lihatuh · May 13, 2006, 05:41 PM // 17:41

I'll bring out my usual arguments against raising the cap here

1. There are hundreds of games with high levels. Try Sacred, great Diablo-like hack n slash with an awesome community and a max level of 216. Diablo lets you have 99, WoW gives you up to 60, EQ2 up to 70... heck even Oblivion for level 60+ if you build your guy right.
2. To keep the same balance and accessiblity for the 'casual' player (which is the whole point of gw - don't penalise the casual players who have skill but no time) you'd have to effectively double the levelling process if you doubled the cap. Ok, so they've made it a bit faster in Factions, but seriously, I'm already lvl 7 on one of my new chars in 1.5 hours... any faster than that and they might as well give both PvP AND PvE players maxed out chars to start with
3. Guild Wars is a fairly unique idea; items and levels don't matter. They can give slight advantages, sure, but at the end of the day its been tested and proven that things such as Sundering give no more than 3 extra damage (not certain on the number there, may even be too generous

) As a level 20 pve-er you can kill lvl28+ monsters easily IF you have good team work and communication. Some people can even do it solo. Why make it easy to kill them simply coz we're now 12 levels above them..
4. It would lead to even more elitism. It's bad enough if you get to the desert at lvl 19, OMG UR NOT LVL 20 WE DUNT WANT U!. Just imagine if you got there at level 38 instead of 40... you'd never get anywhere

I realise the level cap is pushing people away, its pushed my boyfriend away, but thats because he's one of these people who gets no satisfaction unless he levels up (not saying htats a bad thing, I love the feeling as much as the next person). He can't appreciate the challenge of soloing a hydra and feeling all powerful, NOT because you have an uber maul of death doing the work for you, but because you worked out a build and you ran it well. Or the feeling from henching your way through all the missions and still managing to finish the game... there are a ton of ways to achieve stuff in this game that take thought and skill and reward you with pride. Levelling up takes no skill and certainly gives no pride, simply that 1 second flash of "yay level!"

MCS · May 13, 2006, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by [FnG] Lazz

Real mature that is. Firstly you go on about how this thread should be closed because of flaming, then you go ahead and call those people who want a higher level cap "little idiots"

I already said I would not be mature in my first post. I see no reason to be mature, I was mature by ignoring the other 1,000 "PLZ RAISE LEVEL CAP" threads before this one.

Honestly, how do you want me to describe them? I would call them retarded but that is being mean to truely mentally challenged people.

I swear to god, I wouldn't have to flame them if they understood anything at all. They don't even understand that most people don't share their idiotic opinion. Hell I even have proof.

Quote:

No, leave it as it is. 101 69.18%

That means 70% of the people here DON'T WANT IT CHANGED.

Seriously you bought a game that advertised a level 20 and even stated several times that they NEVER planned to raise the level cap in expansions then an expansion comes and you're like what the level cap wasn't raised?! Hi, hello?!

Frankly there is no other way to describe them, they bought a game that isn't the type of game they like just to bitch about it on a forum, they're idiots.

Zakarr · May 13, 2006, 05:47 PM // 17:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarun

Check out the suggestions forum, I've posted a few minor ideas such as being able to say you're using a rare weapon and it showing up in gold text, cancel button for entering guild scrims and a few other things.

Don't take it too personally, Tarun.

Level cap is integrated to the core. Changing it will change a lot of other things. I'm sure everyone who read these forums are aware of your opinion but it doesn't mean everyone should agree. We don't have opportunity to try higher level cap. Only GW developers have. I like current level cap and don't need change for it. You feel there should be a change. I assume that majority of GW's community accept level 20 cap because otherwise Anet should change it or they lose majority of their players or at least make them very unhappy. Democracy wins here.

View Poll Results: Should the cap be raised sometime in the future?
No	117	61.90%
Yes	43	22.75%
Maybe after a couple of expansions	31	16.40%
Make the players that level up not allowed to be in arena battles	15	7.94%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 189. You may not vote on this poll

May 13, 2006, 03:48 PM // 15:48	#603
Taurus Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Mexico Guild: Go for the eyes [jizz] Profession: W/Mo	- Games that requires a lot of time to reach a lvl cap for your character time from time are for FULL TIME GEEKs, outta here you freaks, GW doesnt need you. - Listen, Im not any way related to Anet or anyone working there, but I am 100% sure they will NEVER ( yeah that means NEVER ) raise the level cap so quit whining and go get your faction points. Remember : NEVER. - IMO Anet should LOWER the level cap just to make those whining nerds leave our fine game.

May 13, 2006, 04:24 PM // 16:24	#609
Rakj Grazon Banned Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In a house on a street Guild: Looking for good guild	i think lvl 20 should be the max. The idea of this game was to make an mmo that doesnt eat your life. I read in the little add thingy in my box. "The MMO for everyone who hates MMO's, and for those who love them too." if you want 99 lvl then go play D&D, a game more life consuming.

May 13, 2006, 05:41 PM // 17:41	#618
Pevil Lihatuh Jungle Guide Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Yorkshire, UK Profession: R/Me	I'll bring out my usual arguments against raising the cap here 1. There are hundreds of games with high levels. Try Sacred, great Diablo-like hack n slash with an awesome community and a max level of 216. Diablo lets you have 99, WoW gives you up to 60, EQ2 up to 70... heck even Oblivion for level 60+ if you build your guy right. 2. To keep the same balance and accessiblity for the 'casual' player (which is the whole point of gw - don't penalise the casual players who have skill but no time) you'd have to effectively double the levelling process if you doubled the cap. Ok, so they've made it a bit faster in Factions, but seriously, I'm already lvl 7 on one of my new chars in 1.5 hours... any faster than that and they might as well give both PvP AND PvE players maxed out chars to start with 3. Guild Wars is a fairly unique idea; items and levels don't matter. They can give slight advantages, sure, but at the end of the day its been tested and proven that things such as Sundering give no more than 3 extra damage (not certain on the number there, may even be too generous ) As a level 20 pve-er you can kill lvl28+ monsters easily IF you have good team work and communication. Some people can even do it solo. Why make it easy to kill them simply coz we're now 12 levels above them.. 4. It would lead to even more elitism. It's bad enough if you get to the desert at lvl 19, OMG UR NOT LVL 20 WE DUNT WANT U!. Just imagine if you got there at level 38 instead of 40... you'd never get anywhere I realise the level cap is pushing people away, its pushed my boyfriend away, but thats because he's one of these people who gets no satisfaction unless he levels up (not saying htats a bad thing, I love the feeling as much as the next person). He can't appreciate the challenge of soloing a hydra and feeling all powerful, NOT because you have an uber maul of death doing the work for you, but because you worked out a build and you ran it well. Or the feeling from henching your way through all the missions and still managing to finish the game... there are a ton of ways to achieve stuff in this game that take thought and skill and reward you with pride. Levelling up takes no skill and certainly gives no pride, simply that 1 second flash of "yay level!"